Stone Energy v. Dynamite

[Wildfire2099]

So I was thinking about stone today, and I realize how unbalanced the two options to buy more stone are.

First, we have dynamite, which costs 50 AP, and gives one an average of 80 swings of the pick (assuming one is smart enough to use it when the board is full)

Then we have direct NRG purchase.. which for 200 Diamonds (equivalent of 40 AP) you get 20 swings of the pick.

That seems REALLY off to me.  I think if I was going to change it, I'd make the 200 diamond purchase give you full NRG.. that would balance things out, and make stone upgrades a bit more useful.

Thoughts?

[Listat]

Well if you're going to suggest that, you should make it equivalent to the swings, so if it's 50 AP for 80 swings for dynamite, 200 diamonds (40 AP) should give you around 60 swings, so 60 energy. If you don't limit it, and make it full energy restore, people like me with 70+ mining energy would just tear it up.

I think it's basically what we call a money sink, you take a dynamite, and use it, but you have all those squares that you still need energy to mine. Take into account the ease of obtaining diamonds vs AP as well.

[DexterDaBird]

Just curious where you are getting an average 80 energy per dynamite.  

2+3+4+5+6 = 20

20/5 = 4 damage on average to each tile.

4*16 tiles = 64 damage to a full board.

So 50 AP = 64 energy.

If 50 AP = 250 diamonds that is 3.9 diamonds per energy on average.

If 200 diamonds buys us 20 energy that is 10 diamonds per energy.

Assuming we get a perfect detonation on our first dynamite and have done 6*16 damage to the board.  The second dynamite will now cause 2-4 points of damage to the remaining tiles.

This should average about 3 damage per tile giving us a total of 48 damage.   = 5.2 diamonds per energy, still much better than buying the energy outright.

Even a worst case scenario of all 2's to 16 tiles is still 250diamonds/32energy or 7.8 diamonds per energy.  Still better than the 200 diamond for 20 energy option.  

So in every case it makes sense to detonate 2 tnt per clear.  More discretion must be used on the third tnt as it may or may not be efficient.  

If the 200 energy option were linked in to the max stone skill that would really make things more interesting in the mining world.  Listat is right, if it refilled all energy that would be insanely op, but maybe a percentage of energy making it worthwhile to boost stone capacity?  More skills in the stone family could make mining alot more fun.

Maybe a skill that adds a small % chance to dig up a diamond/crystal/petfood on each tile?

Or something like demolition expert which gives you a small % chance to get a better tnt or not lose a tnt on detonation.  

There are many ways to expand upon the mining system and I hope that Ray comes back to it eventually.  There are just bigger fish to fry right now.

[Aaron Storm]

If you just used dynamite to clear a mine level you would eventually get down to a few tiles left. For instance if you used dynamite 4 times you could have a tile with 2 hits left. You would need energy to clear it.

Yes the diamonds of NRG is not as efficient, but I imagine it's for when you are just about to clear the field but run out of energy. Like let's say you were a wallet warrior and just 10 crystals off from an orb unlock and a mere 20 energy from clearing a mine level. I can imagine you spending 250 diamonds to clear it.

Plus there are probably going to be mining upgrades at some point. If one of those gives two hits for one energy and another gives a chance to hit for double like the woodcutting upgrades, then it's going to start to even out a lot.

[Wildfire2099]

You're right Dex, it's 64, not 80... I had in my head that there were 20 tiles for some reason. I was assuming that when one buy dynamite one uses it as effectively as possible (using one stick on a new board, then finishing the board with regular mining, which is what I always do). I can see doing 2 if you're in a hurry to get stone, but you're leaving swings on the table that way, for sure.

I don't think it would be THAT overpowered... you can't get much past 100 energy without really spending, I'd think (mine is 82 atm).. The cost could be tweak, certainly. The disparity is just kinda glaring (even if it's not quite as bad as I thought).

What it would add is a little more strategy... it would give another viable option to spend diamonds on, that seems like a good thing to me. I suppose it could be set to a max of 100... that would be less interesting, but perhaps more balanced.