Multiple Accounts & Scripting

[icecab21]

just as long as the system still allows us to do challenge mode, sounds like a good system. i don't want to start a challenge and then not be able to progress because i ran out of clix when i otherwise could have beaten the challenge.

[CRIMSONKING]

(02-15-2015, 05:58 PM)Ray Wrote: I think I may have a solution...after I attempted implementing 'auto click' into the game and delving into other suggested solutions on the development client/server to try it out, it felt way too awkward and I know it will confuse players as to what the heck the purpose even is of 'click' upgrades.


So, that being said, how can we allow auto clicking without making it allow you to progress significantly quicker than those who don't use or don't know how to use such programs, but also reward those who do click a little further without adding anything overly complicated, while also not harming those who do use scripts?

Clix! 

A mana/stamina/currency for clicks. Each click reduces the Clix count, and when it reaches zero, takes a bit of time to replenish. This could actually expand the game and strategy significantly...

Balances:

• Click Damage could be increased by a good margin because of this. Active progression play suddenly becomes more valuable.
• Abilities could cost clix as well to avoid ability scripting as being all that useful.
• Clix would regenerate over time.
• New upgrades for max clix and clix regeneration 
• Scripting becomes less of an issue, and perhaps even a supported feature with an auto toggle
• New systems to replenish clix quicker (Special spawns), global events, etc.
• Enough clix would be provided for a duration (not 5 clicks, you're out)
• Abilities can be expanded significantly later with actual costs.
  

I feel this avoids defeating the purpose of clicks/abilities (manual strategical progression), and people can use scripts all they want for clicks/abilities if they really feel it necessary without me having to work against the bot-clock.

Will the upgrades for this new system be in gold, Ap, or Diamonds?

Also will the gold we've invested into auto skills be refunded, used directly for the new system or be a loss against us? Thanks.

[lithe333]

(02-15-2015, 05:58 PM)Ray Wrote: ...
[*]Abilities could cost clix as well to avoid ability scripting as being all that useful.
...
[*]Enough clix would be provided for a duration (not 5 clicks, you're out)
...
[*]Abilities can be expanded significantly later with actual costs.
...

I'm hoping this will not make it hard to beat bosses,
The most recent boss fight (10 of 10)
I would beat 1 boss, then wait 1 minute and repeat.

If the clix system would inhibit this to the point where I can't beat the boss in one sitting due to using abilities or clicking too much, I would be.... sad

Also.. after skimming this whole topic/thread...

Auto clicking is not the same as double damage.
I've used it sometimes but most of the time I would just idle...
My idle damage is around 2x or 3x my auto click damage since I upgrade my idle much more.
(My idle base is only 1.5x my click base because I upgrade it for the splat ability, but if you combine all the other bonuses and speed, this amounts to 2x to 3x)
To people who have upgraded their clicking a lot, this false "double damage" idea.. and the move to correct it would be severely disadvantageous.

I dislike the change.. but if it happens, I will go with it.
I'm hoping that the clix system would be balanced enough to cater to these people as well.
Also.. the clix system would make it much harder for me to "math it" to determine which upgrade I should do next. xD

[CRIMSONKING]

(02-21-2015, 10:29 AM)lithe333 Wrote:

(02-15-2015, 05:58 PM)Ray Wrote: ...

[*]Abilities could cost clix as well to avoid ability scripting as being all that useful.
...
[*]Enough clix would be provided for a duration (not 5 clicks, you're out)
...
[*]Abilities can be expanded significantly later with actual costs.
...

[*]


I'm hoping this will not make it hard to beat bosses,
The most recent boss fight (10 of 10)
I would beat 1 boss, then wait 1 minute and repeat.

If the clix system would inhibit this to the point where I can't beat the boss in one sitting due to using abilities or clicking too much, I would be.... sad

Also.. after skimming this whole topic/thread...

Auto clicking is not the same as double damage.
I've used it sometimes but most of the time I would just idle...
My idle damage is around 2x or 3x my auto click damage since I upgrade my idle much more.
(My idle base is only 1.5x my click base because I upgrade it for the splat ability, but if you combine all the other bonuses and speed, this amounts to 2x to 3x)
To people who have upgraded their clicking a lot, this false "double damage" idea.. and the move to correct it would be severely disadvantageous.

I dislike the change.. but if it happens, I will go with it.
I'm hoping that the clix system would be balanced enough to cater to these people as well.
Also.. the clix system would make it much harder for me to "math it" to determine which upgrade I should do next. xD

lol and for those of us that have levelled up idle and click at the same rate? How do you argue that the dmg is not doubled, via autoclicking? Actually, it really isn't double damage it is even more so, since most autoclickers also use skills.

[lithe333]

(02-21-2015, 11:23 AM)CRIMSONKING Wrote: lol and for those of us that have levelled up idle and click at the same rate? How do you argue that the dmg is not doubled, via autoclicking? Actually, it really isn't double damage it is even more so, since most autoclickers also use skills.

so far... everyone I talk to.. always have idle at higher levels..
if not completely focusing on idle damage.
(hence my assumption of auto > click)

if you are also using skills.. then I guess you are using more advanced auto clickers?
(isn't that like scripting ... area.. macro? iono... unknown area to me.. lalala)

I just use a software that clicks for me wherever my cursor moves.. so i don't have to click like crazy...
I mainly use it for boss fights.. and I think I've only left it on overnight.. like once?

I don't see auto clickers as that big of a problem,
I don't mind do not click monsters as long as.. if i accidentally click, i can easily remove it.
I don't mind a clix system as long as it doesn't stop me from beating the boss 10 times in one sitting.

who exactly are these "most auto clickers"? I've played for less than 2 weeks, there are around 100 people ascended and less than 80 people higher than lvl 50.
im 49, not ascended.

how many of these top players are idle only? and how many are auto clickers?
you are ranked around 60th, and your level is around 53? (guessing from your ability score)

is this just paranoia? do people just think everyone else are using auto clickers because they are leveling much faster than you?

like unless they are constantly using skills 24/7, I don't think auto clicking can give you that much of an advantage.
being in a party with supporter bonuses, party ascension skill, VIP levels... seem to give a much more significant boost.

hmm...... so i guess to main problem should be people using the skills 24/7
NOT
"clicking = double damage"

which I still stand by.. and I kind of .. ignored/diverted your reply?

[CRIMSONKING]

(02-21-2015, 11:41 AM)lithe333 Wrote:

(02-21-2015, 11:23 AM)CRIMSONKING Wrote: lol and for those of us that have levelled up idle and click at the same rate? How do you argue that the dmg is not doubled, via autoclicking? Actually, it really isn't double damage it is even more so, since most autoclickers also use skills.

so far... everyone I talk to.. always have idle at higher levels..
if not completely focusing on idle damage.
(hence my assumption of auto > click)

if you are also using skills.. then I guess you are using more advanced auto clickers?
(isn't that like scripting ... area.. macro? iono... unknown area to me.. lalala)

I just use a software that clicks for me wherever my cursor moves.. so i don't have to click like crazy...
I mainly use it for boss fights.. and I think I've only left it on overnight.. like once?

I don't see auto clickers as that big of a problem,
I don't mind do not click monsters as long as.. if i accidentally click, i can easily remove it.
I don't mind a clix system as long as it doesn't stop me from beating the boss 10 times in one sitting.

who exactly are these "most auto clickers"? I've played for less than 2 weeks, there are around 100 people ascended and less than 80 people higher than lvl 50.
im 49, not ascended.

how many of these top players are idle only? and how many are auto clickers?
you are ranked around 60th, and your level is around 53? (guessing from your ability score)

is this just paranoia? do people just think everyone else are using auto clickers because they are leveling much faster than you?

like unless they are constantly using skills 24/7, I don't think auto clicking can give you that much of an advantage.
being in a party with supporter bonuses, party ascension skill, VIP levels... seem to give a much more significant boost.

hmm...... so i guess to main problem should be people using the skills 24/7
NOT
"clicking = double damage"

which I still stand by.. and I kind of .. ignored/diverted your reply?

Rank is of no concern to me. I told my buddy about the game and helped him level instead of pursuing a higher rank. For those that only focus on idle damage, that would be just silly. As the cost continually increases per level up. It's hard to to imagine that someone would save up for 10m gold to increase their idle damage by 4 vs spending 100k to increase their click damage by 4 instead.

Clicking is double damage if you have common sense and use your gold efficiently. You seem to be too caught up in being right about clicking does not equal double damage, to do the math and see that it does. lol Any way, play the game however you choose to, it doesn't affect me. I am looking forward to the new system though.

[lithe333]

(02-21-2015, 12:27 PM)CRIMSONKING Wrote: Rank is of no concern to me. I told my buddy about the game and helped him level instead of pursuing a higher rank. For those that only focus on idle damage, that would be just silly. As the cost continually increases per level up. It's hard to to imagine that someone would save up for 10m gold to increase their idle damage by 4 vs spending 100k to increase their click damage by 4 instead.

Clicking is double damage if you have common sense and use your gold efficiently. You seem to be too caught up in being right about clicking does not equal double damage, to do the math and see that it does. lol Any way, play the game however you choose to, it doesn't affect me. I am looking forward to the new system though.

a completely idle build isn't silly, since most of the time you don't have time to click.. why not just focus 75-100% resources on auto.
yes costs increases per level, but for someone who levels everything up evenly, they have to play manually.. at least half the day.. if not use a program to play for it to be worth it..
I thought the assumption is.. that regular players will be idling 90% of the time.
obviously at some point you will upgrade clicking.. but I try to keep my auto upgrades around double (in level) of the clicking upgrades.
yes I am caught up on being right in that..... I think using "clicking is double damage" as the main reason to make a change in the game... is a bit ridiculous.
someone using skills 24/7 is a much more significant issue?

yeah I will play the game however I want.. but it seems the changes are definitely happening
so I'm curious... like, is this just born out of paranoia.. and people are just escalating it?
but I guess it is better to fix it now..

ps.. lvl 9 base dmg costs 100k and is +2.
lvl 36 (where I'm up to) costs 5m and is +5
so you are exaggerating the difference quite a bit.

= = =

here.. i math'd it, using roughly ideal upgrades..
assuming level 30 account, 5 mil gold used on auto/click upgrades



first % = how much resources on auto/click.
first table is to calculate dps for how much resource you put into it.

second is comparing auto/click dps .. assuming various auto/click distribution of resources, and also factoring in how much auto clickers help.. in those builds
and how much skills would help

assumed base attack speed = 1 attack every 2 seconds
skills are lvl 10 speed and atk dmg, both 85%, and assumed cooldown of 60 seconds.

skills are not as unbalanced as they seem...

also, i think if I did a lvl 50, 100 mil version, it would probably show that things have a greater effect, but that is too much work xD

[Skream]

Between level 40-60 auto atk dmg it goes back and forth from 5 and 6 dmg per upgrade, so basically 5.5 per upgrade at later levels. auto atk speed is 300 million for level 11 from 15% - 15.5% atk speed, base dmg is 23.8 million for damage 251-257 at level 61

[MarkVM]

Wait, but auto clickers shouldnt work right? since there's a pause between clicks

[CRIMSONKING]

(03-28-2015, 09:05 PM)MarkVM Wrote: Wait, but auto clickers shouldnt work right? since there's a pause between clicks

lol, just to clear this up for you. When people auto clicked, it wasn't to speed up the click while playing. It was to click while afk from the computer, giving players who used it an advantage over players who didn't. Someone could go to work for 8 hours and click for 8 hours, vs someone who had to stay at their computer and manually click for those 8 hours. Giving a huge boost in damage. Now with the new system and idle bonus dmg, this problem has been solved by Ray. 

Hope that helps.